Zelda Mafia Round 2 Night One (IMPORTANT, REPLACEMENT NEEDED!)

[I am nobody]

What I mean:

When I say it does not make it that much easier, I mean that while it does make it easier for the mafia, the extent to which it does so is not gurranteed to be game changing.

[ZeldaGirl]

^Except if they can actually FIND THE HERO CHARACTER. Last time, they got YOU! It was their mistake that they didn't actually learn your real identity! To think, if they had actually succeeded in getting you, YES, THINGS WOULD HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT.

I cannot get over the fact that you are actually willing to accept that fact. It makes you all the more guilty in my eyes.

[Apollo the Just]

Then why don't you explain why you were so open to role claiming yourself?

I think it's because you knew the people you had to fear were on your side.

Sorry, and goodbye.

Vote: ian

[I am nobody]

Yes, I am open to role claiming myself. And if I do so I will give reasons as to why you should believe me. (Last time I just said I was the running man, however all roles have a sub title. Nobody caught that. I will give all the information about my role if I am forced to role claim.

[ZeldaGirl]

See, the thing is ian, that kind of attitude... it doesn't HELP anything. It makes it that much easier for the mafia to narrow their list. It's borderline selfish.

[Apiary Tazy]

i_a_n.....

You just screwed up.

You better find a way out of your hole

But, if you don't.....

Vote: ian

[Daos]

You can lie about your role claim, anyone can.

Role claim: I am the Deku Princess, once per day I can hide myself in a bottle.

You see, a fake role claim.

[Saria Dragon of the Rain Wilds]

Fwah. Blake! Dude. Seriously, nice move drawing suspicion to yourself to gain insights into possible alliances. Congratulations, you have lost my FoS, though I'll still be watching you. This could quite possibly one of the cleverest ploys in the history of Mafia.

ian, you're digging yourself a hole. The way we are all reading your posts, it seems very clear that you were trying to state two different opinions about role claiming. This is a strange behaviour, and none of us are quite willing to trust you.

Ah, of course my post was viciously smacking you all for being party poopers, TML! As far as I can see, you all bloody well are trying to vote off HotD in the first day, due to some imagined guilt And yes, I will defend her honour, since "being emotional" is about the best evidence that Wyborn could come up with. My reason for not saying much else is primarily because I don't feel the urge to tell everyone the tracks I'm following. I'd prefer to have something tangible, if I will present a FoS or even an idea. Blake had been acting so aloof and weird, and Wyborn is too bloodthirsty for me to be comfortable.

He's openly stated he's willing to kill Townies. That is a huge red flag waving in my face.

Current FoS: Wyborn

---

Also, you remember all that talk about leaders and people following. Well isn't it funny how swiftly the FoS and Votes have changed without Wyborn here to be pushy?

[I am nobody]

Look at it this way.

I don't role claim, and get killed. The mafia discovers my role, and has 15 players left.

I role claim and don't get killed. The town dosen't reach a vote. The mafia discovers my role, and has 15 players left.

I role claim and the town kills a differnt townie. The mafia discovers two roles, and has 14 players left.

I role claim and the town kills a mafia. The mafia discovers my role, and has 15 players left.

I role claim and the town kills the slasher. The mafia discovers my role and has 14players left.

I role claim, and the town kills a hero. The mafia elminates one hero, and has 14 players left.

In almost every case it ends the same way.

[The Missing Link]

Ah, of course my post was viciously smacking you all for being party poopers, TML! As far as I can see, you all bloody well are trying to vote off HotD in the first day, due to some imagined guilt And yes, I will defend her honour, since "being emotional" is about the best evidence that Wyborn could come up with. My reason for not saying much else is primarily because I don't feel the urge to tell everyone the tracks I'm following. I'd prefer to have something tangible, if I will present a FoS or even an idea. Blake had been acting so aloof and weird, and Wyborn is too bloodthirsty for me to be comfortable.

I'll buy that.

Retract FoS: SD

Current FoSes: ??? (Still at work, following the conversation, will congeal once I get home)

[Saria Dragon of the Rain Wilds]

For you, in your role right now, maybe that's the case. But I know for certain that 90% of us do not feel safe role claiming, because that gives the Mafia even the barest of advantages against us. They don't need any help in killing us, thank you.

[Apollo the Just]

Ian, AGAIN, even after stating you're not contradicting yourself... YOU CONTRADICT YOURSELF.

You've SAID YOURSELF that role claiming would make it easier for the mafia to find the heroes, even if not by too much. But if you role claim, even with the fancy subtitles; that's just proving the point. YOU'VE BEEN TOLD TIME AND AGAIN that role claiming doesn't help. Think of it this way.

IF A TOWNIE READS THE ROLE CLAIM
-they won't believe you
IF THE MAFIA READS THE ROLE CLAIM
-if it's a true role claim, they'll have one less target and be able to start picking out the hero
-if it's a false role claim, they'll think you're the hero and kill you
-if you're one of them, YOU'RE A MAFIOSO.
IF THE SLASHER READS THE ROLE CLAIM
this depends on their objective. Chances are, they won't believe it... or WILL believe it... or maybe they have the eye of truth and can figure that out... but REGARDLESS, they'd just kill off somebody anyway, not really caring who it is... then again, maybe they want to kill the heros... but ANYWAY.

(of course, these are assuming you role claim as a townie, which I'm pretty sure you'd do.)

Now, listen..

The point is that if you had nothing to hide, you wouldn't role claim. Townies, your supposed allies, would disbelieve you. Your supposed enemies, the mafia, would either find out you're a hero and kill you, or find out you're NOT a hero and leave you alone so they can go kill the REAL hero. Remember, with three kills a night, people will go fast... and the mafia's options as to who the real hero is will be narrowed. ROLE CLAIMS ARE STUPID.

AND SUSPICIOUS.


So, even in the one scenario that

[Daos]

Except, you STILL don't have to role claim to prove your innocence. If you look back at both times a role claim were asked for in the first game they were both MAFIA PLOYS. We were trying to flush out the heroes using my (Bongo Bongo's) ability however when you role claimed we took your word because we thought "hey, the noob would not know any better". The second time was when I tried to get Chunky to role claim but that backfired when I did not withdraw my vote, something HotD picked up on immediately. By asking someone to role claim I can't help but wonder if you are trying the same tactic.

[I am nobody]

My point is, if I don't role claim, I get killed and the mafia finds my role. If I do role claim, and people belive, the mafia discovers my role but, the town has a chance to pick out a mafia.

Daos: Role claiming is a last resort. I've given my defense, and no one believed it. I don't have much else of a choice.

[Apollo the Just]

DOUBLE POST

ignore the last sentence fragment. I started typing it, then typed on top of it and forgot to delete it.

[Blake]

There are ways to look at the percentages Ian to make them look like it's not a big deal but it is really. Role claiming isn't going to help the townies zero in on mafia. It's going to help the mafia zero in on hereos, watch:

You role claim to a townie:
Townie = 1/20 people known, 5% information

You role claim to a mafia. We'll say there's 4 mafia in their worst case scenario:
Mafia = 5/20 people known, 25% information

And let's not forget that 5% information helps the slasher

So in some kind of theory, you save your life(best case scenario). The townies receive only 5%, but the evil receives 10% information(sort of). And that 10% information is double that of a townie's information, so it benefits evil more. In return, if you role claim, you receive 0% information.

[Daos]

Except you could lie, are you not even reading what we are saying?

[Mikhail Gorbachev]

...you guys are acting like complete ****ing kulaks.
Are you still willing to believe ian a mafia in light of this post? He knew something that no one could possibly know if they weren't a townie.
IMO, ian's just being ian, and being just as erratic and irrational as he was last game. (no offense)

[Cravdraa]

Votes

HotD: Wyborn, Rayman FREAK, Marilink, ian (4)
Blake: Shadow_Kirby (1)
Ian: ZeldaGirl, Daos, CuccoLady, Zant Ten (4)
Abstain: Blake (1)

With 21 left it takes 11 to lynch.

[I am nobody]

Both sides recieve 5% information.